Beware - escrow doesn't protect you, clients can withdraw their money

I can not agree with Nichola " I'm afraid the answer is (even if it's a lemon), to move on. "

HEEEELL NAAW! If I work and I don't get paid, how am I supposed to move on?

Tell the landlord " hey man, move on...even if its a lemon! "

Tell the same thing in the stores and tell the same thing when I get my utility bills? 
Hey guys...just move ooon, I didnt get paid, so I won't pay you this time ok?

Nope, sorry to say its not ok, the world we live in does not work like that. Stealing from someone like that it totaly not okay! Move on and you'll be ripped off again and again...thats just stupid.

I'd just like to say that this is not an issue of justice but of practicality.

PPH deals with banks and people. To work with banks, PPH is subject to whatever terms and conditions they impose.

As I understand it, apart from PPH dissappearing, the escrow deposit is safe EXCEPT when a bank decides to reverse a charge/transfer.

There has always been a danger when a credit card or bank account is used fraudulently, that the bank may suck back the funds that it paid illegally.

This is something that can happen in any situation where banks and credit cards are used - it's not PPH specific.

There has (as I understand it) been one case where a client has paid funds into escrow, then later asked their bank to reverse the transaction - which they did - bypassing the PPH arbitration process. Again, something that is possible under any circumstances where a credit card is used and you can convince your bank that the paid for service has not been supplied. So, the client bypassed thePPH dispute validation and convinced their bank of their case.

I think this is a very difficullt thing for PPH to tackle. I think the only way they can actually say escrow funds are safe is effectively to guarantee them themselves.

That's my understanding, but it may be wrong. Escrow funds are not absolutely safe, however PPH advertising does seem to suggest they are safe for both parties, so PPH may be responsible already.

The whole thing is a bit of a minefield for PPH so I understand why they are dragging their feet.

If you have a big job, look at stage payments and cross your fingers!

I hear you Paul, thats why I say, pph should actually pay from their own pocket, then fight for their money with the client or the bank, or anyone.

Having ppl who work and dont get paid is not what they want, even if it costs them some money. If Mark was posting a thread saying, hey I got ripped off by a bad client and PPH made sure I get my deposit and stood for me against the client / bank / whatever. That'd make me feel a lot better, now Ive just lost a fair bit of trust in PPH.

If they can't guarantee that you'll get paid for your work, do not advertise it. It's misleading and I don't know but I guess it's not entirely legal.

...and although I agree Paul, I still think it is an issue of justice. We work ( earn sh@tloads of money ) for this site, it should protect us in ( hopefully rare ) cases like this.

Anyone who works, deserves to get paid. It's not about pph or the banks or the client, it's about justice indeed. PPH would be a great site to work for if they'd realise that. I'd leave this site instantly if this would happen to me and they wouldn't pay me ( I understad they're not responsible, still they advertise escrow as a safe place to store your earnings ). You leave any emloyer if they don't pay you right? Even if it's not their fault...that won't help you when you're paying your bills.

I suspect that PPH is no better or worse than any similar operation. If you and the client are in the same country, you can pursue the funds yourself. It's much harder between countries.

Hello vicarius, I think your case is very straight forward. As u mentioned in your post u got the payment from the same client this means client is verified once as he done payment once. If he is objecting payment in other case why he has accepted the invoice.

Please clarify that he has payed for the first job or the second. i unable to understand that how it can happen that with the same client u are getting paid for one job and not getting for another due to verification issue and even though chargeback .

I think Mark case and your case are different. Your case is more strong then  Mark one. Please tell me your status now.

I am afraid very much reading this whole blog. It is going very tough to start job here and recommend others. How will i pay to my developer if i am not getting money for job what i accomplished. And there are many other expenses too.

Mark what is ur update ?

Initiative taken from the PPH side will be highly appreciated in this matter. As I believe on PPh only so we are making account here. Some bad clients are destroying PPH Image. I think PPh should do something in this case. Policies should be transformed for the benefits of all and to reduce fraud too.

waiting for response from PPH side.

Thanks

My take on this is simply that PPH should clearly spell it out like it is. If the message we get is that as long as we have funds in escrow we will definitely get paid, we're not going to see any need to check the client out as carefully as we normally would (by 'normally' I mean in a situation outside pph). If escrow is not failsafe, PPH should explain that, so that we can take it into consideration when deciding which clients we want to work for and which we don't, and how much work we are prepared to do without a stage payment. Escrow is basically a good system but lulling people into a false sense of security is not good and pph should be careful not to do it.

Well said Maggie.

I really look forward to hearing updates of Mark's case btw, let's hope it'll be a happy end after all.

Hello Liveexpert,

In my case, i got 1 project of 750$ and we did our job very well, when our client saw our work,he awarded another job of 100$,

On 20th.Jan. 2012, we complete both of work, client accept our work, submit balance amount, accept invoice, everything he competed that time.

on 23rd. Jan. 2012, we receive 100$ payment,
on 24th. Jan. 2012, we discuss another project with our client, and discussing why our payment is not credited to our a/c, we though lets wait for some time.

On 25th.Jan. 2012, we send a request to pph about asking why our payment is delay, they reply:
" Please be advised your Client is currently under investigation and would advise you discontinue any work currently in progress. Do not pass any further work to the Client as we are working closely with all parties involved to resolve this case"

and after that they said, client issue a charge back, we are try to communicate to the client, we are troubleshooting this case, we would get back to you after some times.

today, i try to communicate to sohail(Customer Support Manager) on skype, he also not reply me.

I just wanted to know, how much this process take time,  in past, is there any freelancer who face this kind of problem and had his money back to their account.
And what should i assume that our money will be back or not.
I just expect that pph should revort me, when ever i ask him something.